Just wanted to comment what my "deal breakers" would/might be for proceeding with a purchase of an Aptera. The Sub 4 sec 0 to 60 would NOT be a deal breaker for me. I hope the car will be "peppy" but I do not need racing car speed.
BUT For ME: Range HAS to be above 400 miles (otherwise like any other EV range!)
Requirement of a helmet in Ontario, Canada MAY be a deal breaker.
Cost is still a worry for me, especially re importing to Canada. But also, I have requested an AWD and 600Mile range and Solar over the rear hatch (I may change that) but ALL those factors, may put it out of my reach if Aptera changes the pricing for such features
I also do NOT need any sort of self driving package...nice, but not a deal breaker if that never happens!
I also think I can handle the width but it sure seems wide!! I'm game to see what it's like once it gets into production.
Value proposition - price
Aerodynamics, which helps assure efficiency/range
Key attributes of Aptera
I doubt wide exposed wheels, like the “roadster” will be on the future vehicles in their pipeline
If not for stability, then what is the issue that it needs to be so abnormally wide that it will not fit in the average American garage? A garage big enough for a large size truck isn't uncommon, but it does greatly reduce the market to less than half...
@Randy #20820 Stability isn't really that much of an issue. Even without a swaybar it already slides WAY before even coming remotely close to rollover. They couldn't even get one wheel off the ground.
I have to agree and hope there's enough computing power to be able to tweak the design to cut away inches from that 88" width and still keep it stable.
As with several others, the width is the deal breaker for me to not do a reserve as it will not fit in my garage. Doesn't help the widest part is down low so easy to be out of sight by others on the road, which could be dangerous. If not initially, maybe they will design a narrower version, something below 74".
All y'all could park here - except for some spots around the Post Office, my town has only nose-in diagonal parking!
At 79", a Slingshot could park 8" from the curb & still not protrude as much as an Aptera that's scraping the curb.
We have many Polaris Slingshot type owners ( with their 79+”width) on the forum. Granted you don’t have the same wheel covers an width but they have nice tires/ rims.. “Any tips on parallel parking a your three wheeled Tadpole configured vehicle to avoid damaging your wheels?”
My deal breaker is the width, specifically because of the problems that might occur while parking the Aptera. I brought this up in a different post. I drive around California a lot, and I'm finding more cities that have ordinances prohibiting street parking with wide vehicles (usually over 80" but the rules are different depending on the city).
Lots of these coastal cities also have heavily used bike lanes, and I'm worried about the low wheel extending into the bike lane with crowds of cyclists passing by.
I'm hoping there will either be a narrower suspension arm option or some sort of smaller European version available shortly after the initial release. If it turns out to be the latter, I hope the early reservation will be transferrable to that vehicle.
Everyone I've told about the Aptera is extremely excited by it but become concerned when they find out the width. My wife has told me she's not interested in driving it for the same reason. Her current car is wider than mine at 73".
That's really my only deal breaker. For me, everything else about the Aptera is perfect.
First of all, I have been following and supporting Aptera since the 2e and had a reservation for that vehicle because one of my core values is efficiency and basically the Aptera is an embodiment of that value. That being said, I have other things I value as well so the deal breakers for me are. 1. If there isn't a 3rd seat option, it will not work for me because I need to be able to move 3 people once in a while. 2. If repairs are difficult or dangerous (their right to repair stance is very encouraging to me so hopefully they design it to be easy to repair) 3. If the US passes the proposed 10K tax credit for cars and does not apply to Aptera, then I will be hard pressed to spend more for a smaller, less capable vehicle. The other BEV I have a deposit down on is the AWD cybertruck and if the tax credit passes, then the cybertruck (6 passengers + cargo + real off road capability) becomes 40K for me and the aptera (400 mile, AWD, solar hatch) becomes 34K. that's a pretty hard sell for me not to pay 6K more for the cybertruck at that point. So I hope Aptera can get in on the tax credits somehow because a 24K Aptera is a no brainer for me.
I have no showstoppers with the car as it is described now. I recognize that it is essentially a new form of road transportation. Neither fish nor fowl and by buying into the first generation of the car you can’t expect the same experience as buying a vehicle from a company that’s been around for almost 100 years. I’m also trying to stay educated on what Aptera is doing. I have concerns, but they are mostly around financials and the ability to produce cars for the public. I’m optimistic though.
I do need a car in my garage in the next 2 years. My commuter is 16 years old. I can keep it running that long, but I’m going to want something new soon.
to save costs and time, they can not add self driving hardware but they prepare design to add it later if customer wants it.
I hope Aptera is not investing time/energy/money into the 'SafetyPilot' feature. Instead they should simply contact comma.ai and seamlessly incorporate OpenPilot into their system. This gets them up and running with a Level 2 system without having to reinvent one. Also, comma.ai's OpenPilot graded very well in a recent Consumer Reports review of driver assist systems... including Tesla.
The dealbreaker for me is not knowing if we will ever see this vehicle built. It seems every year the story changes with different buzz words to match the moment.
Ocean Dragon has reasonable concerns, but I think many are already covered better than it may appear:
1). Aptera's stated policy on "right to repair" means that not only will self-repair be supported (likely even if they go out of business) but also support to make it extremely easy for any independent shop to give it all of the tiny amount of service it will need. Still it would be great if they authorize Pep Boys &/or Bosch, &/or other independent chains(s).
2). Safety does need to match a modern 4-wheeler, for many of us, whether that means conventional airbags OR seatbelt airbags &/or 5-point harness WITH crash-test video proof. However with its truly unique composite roll-cage construction, conventional crush zones may or may not be required. It may rebound after compression, or it may absorb impact by sacrificial destruction, like motorbike helmets with very similar construction. Escape from resting inverted might be better via SIDE windows.
3). They already confirmed it will have over-the-air software updates (FAQ sheet line 214).
4). Their planned 50kW DC charging already adds 500 miles per hour, recharges the US daily average 40 miles in 4.8 minutes, or 100 miles in 12 minutes, 125% as fast as 100kW on any other EV. Whether it is Tesla or CCS is not ALL that important, but I'd prefer CCS, since it seems to be taking over for non-Tesla cars, & there's more than just the one networks.
5). Heat is really only a longevity factor for the battery, which lasts longer kept around room temp or below, instead of it's max around 125F. Since Aptera uses only about 40% as much energy as any other EV, the cooling system will only have to dissipate about 40% as much heat.
Each other major electrical component will last basically forever, as long as it is kept below it's max temp. Each hub motor does house a friction brake, which is unused in normal driving, & therefore generates NO heat except during emergency braking.
If bundling the lines to the wheels reduces flex too much, they won't be bundled, & will work as well as every car for the last hundred years (literally) with hydraulic brakes.
New York State - I believe autocycles still require motorcycle licenses.
I've got a number of issues that may become deal breakers:
1). I am wondering the density of their service centers or service to you vehicles. I really don't want to have to flat-bed the vehicle each time I have an issue which might prevent me from safely driving it to a service center. At least Elio was to contract a service technician at each Pep Boys Automotive Store/Service in the US.
2). Safety. I want to be sure that they have an adequate restraint system and a minimum of 4 airbags. I will not accept seat belt airbags. I want to see a crash test with visualization of the crush zones. The option of a simple roll bar or cage would be nice. This is a vehicle that I will share with friends and family and will not sacrifice their safety. I also want to be reassured that the windshield could be kicked out in case of a roll-over which would trap the occupants.
3). I want to be sure that the car will either get over-the-air firmware updates as well as software adjustments. I would accept upgrades through the Internet and downloaded to a USB flash drive. I am hoping they have a linked smartphone app to the EV.
4). It should have a minimum of 100 kW rate DC fast charging. Whether it is Tesla or CCS is not that important to me, but if I had to choose, I would take a Tesla network.
5). They will need to prove their cooling system. Heat is the main factor of longevity of each major electrical component. Although I view it as an innovation, each hub motor also house the brakes, another generator of heat. This will of course depend upon how much regenerative braking will occur. How flexible the cooling hoses, 3-phase wiring, sensor and hydraulic brake line (7 lines) will be, especially if bundled together.
Solar charging and the degree of regenerative braking are not big issues to me since a large battery (600 kW) more than make up for these miniscule additional watts. I am willing to be a little flexible for solutions may come with time, but I will not forgo safety and ride-quality. Just my 2 cents.
if aptera needs more time tp get the fleet done right, i think they should warn everyone about it and take time.
like tesla did, they can sell a beta version that is "good enough" then allow discount for people who want the finalized version after they brought version 1 so when they buy version 1 they also buy some insurance that they wont have to pay as much for version 2. this keep trust from investors, prospecting customers and customers impatient for version 2, while also delivering a complete version, and the version 1 cars can appeal as a reduced price product. aptera can refurbish used cars so they are insured to be factory quality and replace aftermarket for profit.
I'm sure that NGB will have the opportunity to drive a production-ready Aptera long before I do so I'ma wait for the "Transport Evolved Seal of Approval" before making a deposit.
I'm OK with much of the breakers that have been discussed thus far. I don't mind if you can't make the 400 mile range, but close is OK by me. (360, maybe even 325m) The acceleration figures don't matter that much either. Good regenerative braking to extend range is critical in my mind. My only deal breaker is the delivery date. Miss that, and you've lost me- again.
Ya, there's no point in a thousand-mile range if you can't stand the seats for more than a hundred! My own BEV's seats are only good for a hundred, but so is the battery, so you'd need to get out to charge anyway.
However, Aptera did mention that they are working on their goal of matching Tesla for "the most comfortable seats ever".
After 5.5 years with only a BEV that's now 7.5 years old, my only "service" has been tires, bulbs, cabin air filter, & standard gas-car 12V battery. This is pretty standard for all BEV owners. The only exception I can think of is wipers, but I'm lucky with a garage to keep the sun off them so mine are still okay.
My concern is availability of parts (like windows), service, width, and comfort (like seats). We hear a lot about efficiency, but not much about comfort and other things that make driving enjoyable. I hope they do not make a vehicle that is efficient but miserable to drive. Efficiency will be quickly forgotten by the driver.
Not sure if I can afford or if I can not afford to do without. Kind of is it the limit of the function or function of the limit etc,,,? I do desire one even with the objections I have heard.
Deal breakers: The width AND the length. Parking is sparse where I live, & I am spoiled by the convenient practicality of my Fiat 500e. The good news is that to be legal in EU Aptera needs to make it narrower AND shorter, so that version may be okay for me.
The width seems like a big deal. I will have to test drive one to feel what it drives like in person. I drive a GMC Sierra currently so I am used to large vehicles. But there are roads where my outside wheel rides right on the edge of the road to avoid having mirror-to-mirror contact with other large trucks. It's doable, but I'll have to see how comfortable I feel with the driving experience in person.
While an Aptera deposit is relatively low and totally refundable, the standard logic is to not make a commitment to purchase something that you cannot examine and test yourself in advance. Also things that are outside of the norm must be viewed skeptically, implying that all of us with preorders are not normal. Just as with EV's in general it will take at least 10 years for the general public to accept that highly efficient/ solar powered vehicles are practical.
Aptera should be road legal in Europe.
I understand the 0-60 mph comment!
Are there really that many EVs, not PHEVs that “deliver” 400 mile range.
A recent Edmund testing articles said they weren’t getting the same range as reported by Tesla which is an impressive EV!
Aptera is only offering a Level 2 Safety Pilot “option” but it is not self driving” to the Level of a Tesla. So we are not paying unless the option is chosen.
Yeah....State/ Province/ Country requirements will differ with this “autocycle type “ vehicle. Aptera has folks looking at various difference out there. Hopefully local folks can talk to their local representatives too.
My personally feeling, And I only rode in the old Aptera, given the wide front width and if their new offered Safety Pilot... if anything like my Honda Ridgeline‘s Lane safety mitigation system, which helps keep my mid size but wide truck nicely in my lane... Which I love.... I am getting it! At least I can manage that!
(Width: 91” mirror to mirror vs Aptera’s 88” wheel cover to wheel cover....)
We shall see!
I put a reservation the moment I noticed the tesla charging port, if aptera doesn't end up getting some kind of charging or technology partnership than It may not be worth $30,000 to me.